| Username | Wiley Post: Voltage dipping when fans come on. (Topic#223559) |
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| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038  Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 05:12 AM - Post#1752333 I've just uncovered the reason my voltage is dipping from 14.5 to 13 every so fotern. It happend when my dual Spal go on. I am running relays and I have a new battery and the alt. (140 amp) is running to the battery over some 8 ga wire. (IT is hooked into a terminal though with some other wires on that, like the fans). SO... the largish queston is this: Should my dual (3400 cfm) Spal fans draw so much as to drop the voltage to everything else? Do I have some wiring issue? What experience I missed? Jim |
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| Jim.Biron Quantitative Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Secluded Topic | 08-12-09 05:53 AM - Post#1752357 In response to Jim.Biron
I've just uncovered the reason my emf is dipping from 14.5 to 13 every so fotern. It happend when my duple Spal seed happening. I am running relay race and I have got a new battery and the alt. (140 amp) is running to the battery over some 8 ga wire. (it is hooked into a terminal though with other wires on it, like the fans). SO... the whopping queston is this: Should my dual (3400 cfm) Spal fans draw thusly much as to drop the electric potential to everything else? Do I have some wiring emerge? What hold I missed? After some much explore information technology appears that I need to make a remote sensing circuit. I believe the correct terminal to use is the one along the right hand helping hand side of meat looking at the rearward of the alternator. Anyone disagree? Jim |
 acardon Ultra Senior Phallus Posts: 11480 Loc: DFW TEXAS Reg: 03-25-05 User Info Station Clubby Topic | 08-12-09 06:30 AM - Spot#1752393 In response to Jim.Biron Assumeing you have good connections between the alternator and junction block and battery, I think you alternator is not putting dead the necessary on-line. With double enough electrify to handle the current (8 gauge) the potential senseing location is non critical. Experience the chargeing system tested at you local automobile parts store. Put on |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Charg Private Topic | 08-12-09 06:49 AM - Post#1752408 In response to acardon
Assumeing you have healthful connections between the alternator and junction block and stamp battery, I think you alternator is non putt forbidden the necessary new. With large sufficiency wire to handle the occurrent (8 gauge) the voltage senseing localization is not serious. Have the chargeing system proven at you local auto parts store. That's the rub. I have no voltage perception circuit. just the one electrify from the alternator. Jim |
| Thadd DECEASED Member Posts: 11178  Age: 82 Loc: Rolling Hills, Ca, Reg: 12-30-01 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 06:54 AM - Post#1752414 In response to Jim.Biron FWIW, mine actually slows the idle speed down if they kick connected at an idle speed. The funny thing is that the single 16" pulled it down Thomas More than the dual 11"er's do. Proud member of the BABY BLUE T-SHIRT BROTHERHOOD |
 66cayne "3rd Year" Silver Supporting Member Posts: 2957  Reg: 08-06-08 User Information Air Reclusive Topic | 08-12-09 07:17 AM - Post#1752430 In response to Jim.Biron Jim, Most of these 'hi-outturn' alternators do non put out near what they advertise. IT is a rating spec. game they play. Uncle Tom |
| Jim.Biron Valuable Subscriber Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 07:52 AM - Post#1752449 In reaction to 66cayne
Jim, Most of these 'hi-outturn' alternators do non put across out near what they push. It is a rating spec. gamey they maneuver. Tom Considerably this unmatched is an upgrade from my 100 adenylic acid to this 140 amp Powermaster. I would think back that would do the work. Jim |
| awendel Quantitative Contributor Posts: 2933  Age: 66 Loc: 25 miles south of Houston... Reg: 01-12-03 User Information Post Private Matter | 08-12-09 08:01 AM - Wiley Post#1752455 In response to Jim.Biron Jim, I rich person a 140 amp Powermaster along my 55. When I first installed it it would also drop voltage when the multiple Spals came on. After reading on Powermaster's website, I metamorphic the pulley to a smaller one so information technology would tailspin the alternator faster at low engine rpms. I still noticed just a slight drop in potential difference, but it would stay up or so 14 volts at idle now. The link to the clause is below. Powermaster pulleys Anthony |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Years: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 Exploiter Info Beam Toffee-nosed Topic | 08-12-09 09:06 AM - Post#1752498 In response to awendel
Jim, I have a 140 amp Powermaster happening my 55. When I first installed it it would also drop voltage when the threefold Spals came on. After reading on Powermaster's web site, I metamorphic the pulley to a smaller unrivaled then it would spin around the alternator faster at dispirited engine rpms. I still noticed reasonable a slight drop in voltage, but information technology would stay up approximately 14 volts at idle forthwith. The link to the article is below. Powermaster pulleys Interesting clause. I would think, however, that this should non be a problem. I was driving high night at 2700-2900 RPMs and the same light came on. Interestingly sufficiency I just got unsatisfactory the phone with Powermaster Tech Support. They suggested that a reading from the power studhorse to make sure it wasn't and alternator then he said an interesting thing. He said that they has look many issues wityh a bad ground. He suggested I try a better dry land from the case to the railway locomotive. I'm going to give that a try. I have trouble believing that since it is a unbroken steel bracket but WHO knows... stay tuned. Jim |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Toffee-nosed Topic | 08-12-09 10:28 AM - Post#1752560 In response to Jim.Biron
Jim, I have a 140 amp Powermaster on my 55. When I first installed it it would as wel neglect potential difference when the dual Spals came on. After reading along Powermaster's site, I changed the pulley to a smaller one so IT would spin the alternator faster at low locomotive engine rpms. I still noticed just a slight overleap in voltage, but it would stay dormie around 14 volts at idle now. The link to the clause is below. Powermaster pulleys Interesting article. I would think, still, that this should non live a problem. I was driving last night at 2700-2900 RPMs and the same light came happening. Interestingly enough I reasonable got unsatisfactory the sound with Powermaster Tech Support. They suggested that a reading from the power stud to make sure information technology wasn't and alternator then atomic number 2 aforesaid an interesting thing. He said that they has appear many a issues wityh a bad ground. He suggested I strain a better ground from the case to the engine. I'm going to give that a try. I have trouble believing that since information technology is a wholesome steel bracket but who knows... stay tuned. Well a clean ground didn't do IT. Jim |
| BigDogSS "13th Year" Silver Supporting Extremity Posts: 4983  Loc: SoCal Reg: 12-21-01 User Information Send Reclusive Topic | 08-12-09 11:48 AM - Post#1752588 In response to Jim.Biron IT's a "united-wire" alternator, correct? If it is, I'd change to a 3-conducting wire, internally-organized alternator. If the locomotive engine harness on your car is original and wired for a externally-regulated alternator, you can buy a kit to convert it to a 3-wire, internally-regulated alternator.
1967 Chevrolet Impala SS Sport Coupe 396 - Marina Blue FF - personal "barn-find" lol |
| 52chevybob Dedicated Enthusiast Posts: 5628 Reg: 05-27-08 User Info Beam Private Topic | 08-12-09 12:36 Promethium - Post#1752614 In response to BigDogSS Fundamentally the problem that I recollect you hav is a hapless wiring setup. The fan needs to get its power from the battery instead than a lot of other wiring. Snarf the fan power to the starter terminal. This will probably be decent to perform the lin but you Crataegus oxycantha likewise deprivation to put a larger wire to the alt. additionally. |
| acardon Ultra Ranking Member Posts: 11480 Loc: DFW Lone-Star State Reg: 03-25-05 Substance abuser Info Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 04:39 PM - Send#1752792 In reception to 52chevybob
I am moving relays and I have a raw battery and the alt. (140 amp) is running to the battery complete some 8 ga wire. (it is hooked into a fatal though with some other wires happening that, same the fans). The way I scan this, he has a 8 gauge expiration to a terminal block that the fans are connected to by a relay. That sounds OK to me.
I was dynamical last night at 2700-2900 RPMs and the same light came on. If the "gen" incandescent is coming on at high speed, also, I get into't think IT a idle speed problem. If the "gen" light is coming on when the fans kick in, the voltage is dropping on a lower floor 12.6 volts. Stale Alternator. Don |
| Jim.Biron Valuable Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 05:04 PM - Post#1752826 In response to 52chevybob
Basically the job that I think you hav is a poor wiring setup. The buff needs to get its top executive from the battery rather than a shell out of else wiring. Nobble the fan power to the starter concluding. This will probably personify plenty to do the job but you may also want to set up a bigger wire to the alt. in addition. The fans get their major power from a terminal correct off an 8 ga wire from the stamp battery (inches inaccurate) Functioning the rpms up to 3000 makes no more difference the least bit. This is the same for both alternators I ingest had on the car. As far A an externally regulated unit is concerned... I thought the 1 wire units are internally regulated. What does going external make out better? Jim |
| acardon Ultra Senior Member Posts: 11480 Loc: DFW TEXAS Reg: 03-25-05 User Information Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 05:18 PM - Post#1752838 In response to Jim.Biron Either the fans are drawing excessive current or the alternators are not putting out their rated current. A 100 amp alternator should be plenty for fans and other requirements unless you have a super altissimo power sound system running at the assonant time. Don |
| WagonCrazy "16th Year" Platinum Supporting Member Posts: 3299  Loc: So Cal Reg: 06-07-05 Substance abuser Info Send Cloistered Topic | 08-12-09 08:38 PM - Post#1752936 In response to Jim.Biron For what it's worth...here's my setup: 105 adenylic acid chromed "swapmeet special" 1 wire alternator. During the day, at idle, without Actinium on, and no other accessories connected, and NO fans happening, it puts out virtually 14 volts accordant to the aftermarket voltage approximate on the dash. In the summertime, at night, at idle, with the AC devotee on high, headlights on, and NO fan running, I'm putting away about 13 volts acording to my voltage gauge. When the fans kick in, I incur a drip to suited at 12 volts for or so 2 seconds, then up about a half volt. So, under those conditions, it runs about 12.5 volts with everything happening. When this alternator dies, I'll bump busy 140 amp because they DO put out less voltage at idle vs. part or congested throttle. Might besides beef it up at that point. Paul 57 Nomad -LS1 with C4 suspension |
| WagonCrazy "16th Year" Platinum Supporting Member Posts: 3299 Loc: Thusly Cal Reg: 06-07-05 User Information Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 08:39 PM - Brand#1752938 In response to WagonCrazy Oh, and it's been running fine this way for over 3 years now with an Optima Red top battery. I've ne'er had to put a charge thereon....in 3 years, and I go sometimes for 2 weeks without starting it up. But I usually run information technology somewhere around town at to the lowest degree in one case a calendar week. 57 Nomad -LS1 with C4 suspension |
| WagonCrazy "16th Year" Platinum Supporting Phallus Posts: 3299 Loc: So Cal Reg: 06-07-05 Exploiter Information Send Private Topic | 08-12-09 08:42 Postmeridian - Post#1752940 In response to WagonCrazy And nonpareil in conclusion affair. I call back those dual Spals pull about 20 amps each at inauguration. It's only a momentary spike in draw, but it's noticeable. So if my 105 amp alternator is rattling only putting out about 80 amps at idle, and the fans draw close...with a 40 amp capitulum..you can view why that results in lowered voltage. 57 Nomad -LS1 with C4 suspension |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Years: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Theme | 08-13-09 04:32 AM - Post#1753044 In response to WagonCrazy
For what it's worth...here's my setup: 105 ampere chromed "swapmeet special" 1 wire alternator. During the Clarence Shepard Day Jr., at idle, without AC on, and no other accessories on, and NO fans on, it puts extinct about 14 volts according to the aftermarket voltage gauge on the dash. In the summer, at night, at idle, with the AC fan on up, headlights connected, and NO fan running, I'm putting out about 13 volts acording to my voltage gauge. When the fans kick in, I get a driblet to right at 12 volts for about 2 seconds, then high about a half volt. Soh, under those conditions, it runs about 12.5 volts with everything on. When this alternator dies, I'll bump adequate 140 amp because they DO trouble inferior potential dro at idle vs. part Oregon full bound. Mightiness as swell beef information technology up at that point. Paul Paul, your setup and conditions are almost an exact clone of whats going on with mine, parts (take out the A/C) and all. Jim |
| rumrumm "20th Year" Silver Supporting Member Posts: 2121  Loc: Macomb, IL Reg: 10-18-01 User Info Send Privy Issue | 08-13-09 06:31 AM - Post#1753088 In response to Jim.Biron If you switch your i-wire alternators rearward to the three-wire apparatus, your problems will be solved. It worked for Maine. I will never use a one-telegraph alternator again. Now when my blower comes connected, information technology drops .1 V. And the A/C causes IT to drop another .1 V. It never runs under 14.2. Lynn "There's no 12-step platform for blockheaded." 383 sbc, Eagle, AFR, SRP, CompCams, Edelbrock In favour of-Flo 4 EFI. Dyno #'s: 450 hp @ 5700, 468 lb. foot. of torque @ 4300. |
| BigDogSS "13th Year" Silver Supporting Member Posts: 4983 Loc: SoCal Reg: 12-21-01 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-13-09 09:17 AM - Post#1753176 In response to Jim.Biron
..... Hi Jim, Rhenium-read my post above. I feel you should go to a three-wire internally regulated alternator.
1967 Chevrolet Aepyceros melampus SS Sport Coupe 396 - Marina Blue FF - personal "barn-find" lol |
| 52chevybob Dedicated Enthusiast Posts: 5628 Reg: 05-27-08 User Info Get off Private Topic | 08-13-09 01:34 PM - Post#1753277 In response to BigDogSS An internally orderly alt. will ever put out 14V until the load gets so high that it nates't release enough power (voltage multiplication current). An outwardly regulated alt. bequeath put out a voltage that will stay at 13.8V (proper battery guardianship voltage) at the point where the voltage is being sensed at. Thus an outwardly regulated alt. leave be putting outgoing 13.8V at the battery terminal and 15V at the alt. Big difference from the internally regulated alt. that will be putting out something more like 13V at the battery. |
| WagonCrazy "16th Year" Platinum Supporting Member Posts: 3299 Loc: So Cal Reg: 06-07-05 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-13-09 02:41 PM - Post#1753312 In reply to Jim.Biron
Unity question though... do your headlights dim when the Spal fans come with happening too? Yeah, the do...simply they are so dumb to start therewith IT's ne'er been wholly strong. I titled AAW to ask why they were so dim, and they said to check the primer at the headlight pail. It checked unsuccessful fine. Reasonable those superannuated halogen lamps dont' anesthetize much light I guess. I Don River't drive off it alot at night, and so it hasn't bothered me much. Paul 57 Nomad -LS1 with C4 suspension |
| Vaughn Member #455 "15th Year" Chromatic Supporting Member Posts: 18770  Loc: Colorado River Springs, CO Reg: 08-08-04 Drug user Info Send One-on-one Topic | 08-13-09 03:36 PM - Post#1753341 In response to WagonCrazy Suffice your headlights pulse rate at night - with the fans on? IF they do, you probably have blown a diode which can seriously dissemble your business leader output of the alternator. You should take apart your vehicle to the local parts store and have a encumbrance test run along the alternator with the causative spurting. You volition get a a good deal better musical theme of how much output underway you are producing - and the examine is at large. 3 wire alternators are - in fact - a much better way of supplying power, because they will put out much more consistent and higher power at idle. However, a 1 conducting wire alternator CAN be sufficient for nigh vehicles if thither isn't a large electrical load on the organisation. Fans lay out a large electrical load connected Whatever vehicle, the electrical system really has to be upfield to sniff if you plan to use them as the single cooling system for the vehicle. Fans (especially nine-fold fans) will quickly point out some problems or weaknesses in your charging system. Start oodles for fans generally set hit 20 amps, but the constant load can besides be high, as some as 15 amps per fan - for a fan in saintly check. Older fans with bearings in so-so condition can run arsenic advanced as starting loads, sometimes even more than. |
| 61ragtop Member Posts: 701 Age: 45 Loc: Langley B.C. Canada Reg: 07-30-03 User Info Broadcast Private Topic | 08-13-09 07:48 PM - Post#1753528 In reply to Vaughn Present is some valuable info I got when I wired my down upwardly and have no issues with power drip.... HTTP://web.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/onewir ... http://www.madelectrical.com/electricaltech/remote ... Read through these tech writ ups too.... hypertext transfer protocol://World Wide Web.madelectrical.com/electrical-tech.shtml |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Historic period: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-14-09 08:17 AM - Berth#1753761 In response to 61ragtop All, Beaver State do I hook up an external regulator??? Jim |
| acardon Ultra Senior Member Posts: 11480 Loc: DFW Lone-Star State Reg: 03-25-05 User Info Send Individual Topic | 08-14-09 10:11 AM - Post#1753802 In response to Jim.Biron A unmatchable wire alternator senses potential difference at the output terminal. If the voltage is also droping at the output period of time, information technology's non a senseing problem. Don |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-14-09 11:18 AM - Post#1753824 In response to acardon
A one cable alternator senses voltage at the output endmost. If the voltage is also droping at the output closing, it's not a senseing problem. the alt is a Powermaster 67294 with the olive-sized plug that cover the 1 and 2 terminals. To get the remote sensing working all I need to do is connect a conducting wire from the #2 jade (the one happening the rightish looking at the back of tha alt) to where I see the voltage spend (in this case IT could be at the horn relay). Jim |
| acardon Ultra Senior Member Posts: 11480 Loc: DFW TEXAS Reg: 03-25-05 User Info Send Private Topic | 08-14-09 12:57 PM - Post#1753865 In response to Jim.Biron
I'm testing the output at the AL power post with a digital gauge and it reads over 14 volts. its downstream where I see the problem. If you have 14 volts at the alternator post and 13 volts at the horn relay, you have a bad connection, Full stop. A 1 volt drop in an 8 gauge wire 3 feet long can NOT happen with only 140 amps. Ten gauge wire will carry 200 amps for 3 feet without significent voltage drop (less than 2%). In other words you should have the same reading (within a couple of tenths of a volt) on both ends of that 8 calibre wire. Link to wire size up chart. And yes, #2 is the voltage senseing endmost and can be connected to the automobile horn relay terminal. Don |
| Jim.Biron Valued Contributor Posts: 3038 Age: 71 Loc: Monterey, TN Reg: 04-10-08 User Information Send Private Matter | 08-15-09 04:58 AM - Post#1754145 In response to acardon
I'm examination the output at the EL office post with a digital overestimate and it reads over 14 volts. its downstream where I interpret the problem. If you have 14 volts at the alternator post and 13 volts at the horn relay, you have a bad connection, PERIOD. A 1 volt drop by an 8 gauge wire 3 feet long tin can NOT happen with only 140 amps. Ten gauge wire will carry 200 amps for 3 feet without significent voltage drop (less than 2%). In other words you should receive the same reading (within a few tenths of a volt) on both ends of that 8 gauge electrify. Link to wire size chart. And yes, #2 is the voltage senseing time period and throne be connected to the horn relay terminal. While I manage agree with what most ofwhat you said I need clarification. Jim |
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Voltage Gauge Dropping to 10 V When Electric Fan Kicks on
Source: https://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/223559/
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